NEW INTERVIEW: My second interview with Jason Xenophobic (Xenophobic Records), 12/1/2015

My interview with Jason Xenophobic (XENOPHOBIC WORLDWIDE)

By: Kieran James

Date: 12 January 2015 @ Australind, Bunbury, Australia

Kieran James (BUSUK CHRONICLE): Tell me more about your plans for XENOPHOBIC WORLDWIDE given that the environment in the metal scene is changing all the time?

Jason H: The metal industry is different now - not like back in the day. Now we can’t tell the difference between Commercial and Underground. In Indonesia the marketing of the music is different to western marketing. I called BURGERKILL “sell-out” when they had a picture of THE HAUNTED holding up their BURGERKILL CD. BURGERKILL is bigger than that. That is not the BURGERKILL I supported. We don’t ask people to take sides. People are free to think what they want to think. I’m in the right position to say. If I think I’m wrong I will apologize.  In life I will fight for what I believe in. I will stand up for it. As IMMORTAL TECHNIQUE [rap band] said, if you will die for a cause then make sure it is what you believe in.

KJ: What do you think about BURGERKILL now?

Jason: I don’t give a f*** what they do but I’m really happy with what they are doing. It’s like a marriage – when it’s over it’s over. They do their own things and I do what I want to do. I think we both got something out of it; I won’t lie about it.

KJ: Do you hope they do anything to resolve the problems?

Jason: I don’t really care but I hope they keep their word to the metal people and the metal industry. I’m not happy with the whole thing about how they support the cigarette industry. I know everyone tries to make money but don’t sell-out too much. They are a good band; they have done well for themselves. It’s not a personal issue. I still like them and love their music but it’s just not the same love anymore. I only love a few bands to death such as PANTERA, MACHINE HEAD, and BURGERKILL. When I got really close to them it was different. But, looking at them from outside, I get my appreciation for them again. I would love to see them at Hammersonic from the side of the stage [as a member of the audience]. 

KJ: What is your comment about the band WARKVLT [Bandung BM] whose album you will release on XENOPHOBIC RECORDS?

Jason and Dada Deathstar in Bali, 2015

Jason: A smart band; they are different. In Bandung the sound is if it’s not like JASAD then it is like BURGERKILL. You have to step out a bit from the cycle, you know. I don’t disrespect the scene. This is how I see it looking from the outside. I’m not the only one saying it.

KJ: They say that about the Bandung scene in Surabaya too.

Jason: Well there you go. JASAD had a good sound; BURGERKILL had a good sound. BURGERKILL did very well with that formula. The name change from IMPISH to WARKVLT makes sense. IMPISH is more like high-school kids. When people abuse you but you still act nice about it. That is the meaning of IMPISH to me. WARKVLT says you can’t bully us anymore; we will fight you back. In Indo metal scene IMPISH was bullied too much. We stand for the quality. WARKVLT is f***ing good.

KJ: What is your comment about JIHAD [Cimahi]? As you told me XENOPHOBIC will release a new collectors’ edition of JIHAD Origin of the Rebels Angels this year.

Jason: I always love JIHAD. I love the sound they do. I know Kancil. I love the band. It’s like with DEVO [DEATH VOMIT]. I love the people. With some people you meet them once or twice and you feel you know them forever. I respect this band JIHAD so much. I’m going to issue this album Origin of the Rebels Angels. This is how I felt when I first heard Between Coma and Despair by BURGERKILL. I didn’t have a label then. I just tried to market the band. They thought Indo bands won’t make it. It hurts me how PRIME CUT bring Indo bands to Australia. I call our company XENOPHOBIC. PRIME CUT used to look down upon Indo people. I used to mention JASAD, BURGERKILL, SIKSA KUBUR, and DEVO to them back in the day. Now people claim something to do with that scene. I’m not whinging [complaining] about it. Before they were laughing about Indo scene and now they want to promote it.

KJ: What about the Australian tour of REZUME?

Jason: What I’m saying is these people from the beginning they did not believe us. These companies brought bands in on holiday visas. They brought them in without the paperwork. Anyone can do that.

KJ: What are some new bands you are interested in?

Jason: PARGOCHY [Medan], they are good and HELLSKUAD [Jakarta]. I think PARGOCHY’s battle is not over but they are very big, you know. I used to like CLIMAXETH [Surabaya] – Niza’s band. I don’t know what happened to that girl now. She was the best female vocalist in Indo. I miss that lady. The original person of her was amazing. She was an amazing f***ing growler.

KJ: Have you got any tour plans confirmed for any Indonesian band?

Jason: No, I plan to release a couple of albums first. I will reissue JIHAD – Origin of the Rebels Angels and the new PARGOCHY album. We are thinking of mastering and mixing it in Australia or outside Indo. We want a different approach to the sound. I have a few names in my mind as producer. They will finish at the beginning of the year, this month I hope [January 2015]. I can’t wait to hear the new album. I have a hunch about it. It will really be out there. Only a few bands can capture the imagination. I hope I’m not wrong this time. I think they are a good band. Another band which captures my attention is XTAB [Cimahi]. I think XTAB stands for playing within your own. They know who are going to be their customers. They are young and energetic; I want to see them going up.

KJ: You are promoting two bands from Cimahi then – JIHAD and XTAB. They will be very happy out there in Cimahi.

Jason: Yes, I always like the Bandung bands. I can’t deny it. Bandung has the talent. If bands from other areas come up they must compete with the giant names and they must be good.

KJ: What do you think about Indonesian HC?

Jason & Kieran James, 12/1/2015

Jason: HC is such a funny subject; it’s like gangsta-rap. We can say HC belongs to white people; unless Indo bands are singing in Indo that might make a difference. When Indo bands sing in English it is so awkward to my ear. When they sing in Indo it is so awesome – such as BORN PSYCHO, FINGERPRINT [Medan], OUTRIGHT [Bandung], and FRAUD [Surabaya]. To me I think it is hard to sell Indo HC to the non-Indonesian people because of the xenophobia.

KJ: Have you got more comments about the Bandung UG scene?

Jason: They are good and professional; they have been doing it for a long time. They have the advantage of location near Jakarta and the cool weather. They have the passion; they are the Paris Van Java.

KJ: Do you think too many Bandung bands play the same style of brutal death-metal?

Jason: It’s not much of a problem; the more the merrier. The good thing about metal is everyone is a player. You have got to think of it in a good way. Everyone is a fan.

KJ: Have you talked to DEVO about the plan for another Australia tour by them?

Jason: We talked about it; we miss them. We want to see them come to Australia. I’m just so busy now. It’s a one-man operation. I can’t dump them to other people. It takes time and energy to get their visas arranged. I need to find the right moment to organize the tour. I got so many invitations from people in Australia asking me whether DEVO will be coming back.

KJ: What do you think of the new DEVO album?

Jason: I got the new album. It is f***ing amazing. I’m happy with the whole lot. There is not much change in the style; they have cemented their own sound. Their sound says who they are. Sofyan and Oki put their own signature upon it. You can’t just say it is just Death Metal; it is the DEATH VOMIT sound.

KJ: I know you are releasing the new album by PARGOCHY from Medan. Do you think it’s a problem that people in Java don’t want to listen to Sumatra bands?

Jason: Yes, that’s the mentality. If a band from Sumatra wants to stand out they have to be very good. If they do the hard work they can achieve something. If they can succeed it will be a bonus that they are not from Java. Medan is famous for their DM as Man JASAD has said.

KJ: Do you prefer any genre over others?

Jason: I don’t care much although I do like BDM better than other stuff. Music is universal. As long as it is good for the audience’s ear that is the main thing. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I’m not stuck to the attitude that it must be slam or BDM only. Just call it metal or brutal metal. As long as people still play guitar music it will still be the same. 

KJ: Do you hope to see JASAD tour Australia?

Jason: I would love to see JASAD in Australia. I reckon that would be the ultimate. I grew up watching them and hearing the name. I would love to see JASAD’s name in Australia.  

KJ: I have seen most of the other Bandung bands live onstage but not JASAD…

Jason: You have got to see Man one time on the stage. He makes the whole experience. JASAD is captivating. Man and Ferly are just amazing. The bass [Yuli] is pretty f***ing good. I never paid much attention to the drummer.

KJ: The old JASAD drummer Papap has formed the new band DISMEMBERMENT TORTURE.

Jason: Yes, you said. 

KJ: How about JAGAL [Surabaya]?

Jason: They are a little bit old, those boys. You hear much more about the name JASAD. Man did so much for f***ing Indo metal. He is the hero. I respect that guy for who he is. It’s a pity what happened with Papap. It’s like SLAYER without Dave Lombardo – the feeling is not the same. FORGOTTEN is quite good; DISINFECTED is good; Amenk is smart.

KJ: Amenk has a great stage show.

Jason: There is a lot going on there at the moment. REVENGE from Jakarta is doing well.

KJ: Do you think you can make a profit from XENOPHOBIC?

Jason: I made a little bit of profit but not much. It’s never been about the money; it’s about the passion. I’m patriotic to my people. I like being the underdog. I don’t care about other people’s success.

KJ: What do you think of people mixing religion with metal?

Jason: With music in general you don’t want to hear about religion. We both believe what we believe. I grew up as a Muslim but I saw a lot of shit. I’m not going to say what religion I am. Religion is like sex. It’s a private thing. I don’t want someone singing about their dick size. We don’t care what people do with their lives. Belief is a different subject from music. Metal is about hell-raising. Don’t change it to become religion mumbo-jumbo. If you want religion to make you happy in your own life that is alright but don’t preach it to me.

KJ: What do you think about the band SAFFAR [Bandung]?

Jason: No, they are too religious.

KJ: Aren’t JIHAD a religious band then?

Jason No, they are not.

KJ: Why do you like to listen to hip-hop?

Jason: Back in the day I loved the rebellion in the metal. I’m not into that gangsta-rap we see in the Top 40 such as EMINEM. IMMORTAL TECHNIQUE, ILL-BILL, and VINNIE PAZ, those bands from the UG, plus NECRO – it is polluted from the DM stuff back in the day. He did a song with John Tardy [OBITUARY vocalist]. I love metal. I listen to it now for its intensity and beauty. If I want to listen to lyrics about real-life experiences you can’t beat the UG hip-hop lyrics. I’m only talking about three or four performers. I got inspiration from them. They sing about a lot of taboo subjects which metal has forgotten about. I’m not interested in the racist hip-hop about gun and whore but the political bands.

KJ: Do you want to organize tours for hip-hop bands?

Jason: No, I don’t think so. My heart is still metal to be honest. I might have said it jokingly back in the day but that was not my intention. I listen to all music but I still always go back to metal. That is what I call home.

KJ: Your love for hip-hop now brings out the xenophobia in some people.

   

[Jason laughs.]

KJ: Is Lauren going to be involved with XENOPHOBIC in the future?

Jason: I am not sure; maybe in the future.

KJ: What do you think of me starting Black Hammer Webzine?

Jason: You should go back to Busuk and stay strong about it. It’s your intellectual property. You have the right to say whatever you want. That is why we are here, doing this independent stuff.

*****THE END 

METAL HISTORY: My first interview with Jason Xenophobic (Xenophobic Records), 11/1/2011

Left to Right: Kieran James, Jason Xenophobic, and Lauren Wilson @ Melbourne, 11 January 2011

My interview with Jason Hutagalung of XENOPHOBIC RECORDS (Melbourne, Australia death-metal label)

“I will do it again if I can, it’s an achievement, I’m proud of it, [and] it made history. If I don’t do it no-one else will do it. People are very xenophobic. I believe we came out triumphantly” – Jason Hutagalung about organizing PSYCROPTIC tour to Indonesia and BURGERKILL and DEATH VOMIT tours to Australia

“The boys are very humble, they are very Indonesian. Roy is one of the best drummers in the world” – Jason about DEATH VOMIT   

   

By Dr Kieran James (University of Fiji)

Personal interview at: St Alban’s, Melbourne, Australia, 11 January 2011

Extra comments by: Lauren Wilson of XENOPHOBIC RECORDS

Kieran James and Jason Xenophobic

Kieran James: Jason, mate, first of all thanks for agreeing to do this interview for my proposed book on Indonesian death-metal. First of all, for the record, can you take me through all the events leading up to the DEATH VOMIT tour of Australia in September last year?

Jason: Basically it began following the PSYCROPTIC and BURGERKILL tours in 2009 [KJ: Hobart, Australia band PSYCROPTIC toured Indonesia and Bandung, Indonesia band BURGERKILL toured Australia.] The manager of DEATH VOMIT sent me The Prophecy.

KJ: Corna?

Jason: No, it was before Corna [Irawan], the manager was someone else.  

KJ: OK, maybe we should begin right at the start, with the PSYCROPTIC and BURGERKILL tours...

Jason: I organized the tours called ALLEGIANCE TO METAL. The idea [for these tours is] the relationship between Indonesia and Australia. What we hear is [always] the bad stuff whether it is terrorism or floods. My daughter is half-Indonesian. We know nothing about each other. We need to showcase Indonesian [music] talent in Australia and Australian talent in Indonesia. BURGERKILL started it all [the cultural exchange]. BURGERKILL is the number one in Indonesia, biggest Indonesian metal band. I saw them in 05, 06. I never heard anything like that.

KJ: How do you describe BURGERKILL style?

[KJ: Jason doesn’t like it when my tongue slips and I keep calling the band BURGER KING! Maybe I was hungry! The outer suburbs of Melbourne aren’t exactly a great cuisine mecca.]

Jason: Before you heard of Scandinavian metal, BURGERKILL already had their own style. Bandung is Indonesian Metal King. [There is] JASAD and BURGERKILL. Eighty percent of [Indonesian] bands are run by people from Bandung. Medan scene was huge in the 1990s, [but] Bandung has always been the centre, everything new comes from Bandung.

We made a contract. We have a band management company XENOPHOBIC. In 2009 we decided BURGERKILL will come to Australia, first one ever, [with] no help from Indonesian Government or Australian Government. Everything is legit, [including] performance visas, we are self-funded. We used my wage [KJ: as tattoo artist in St Alban’s].

[KJ: At this point Jason’s partner Lauren Wilson joined the interview]

Lauren: We had to put all money into one account [because] we had to show it to the Australian Government. We had to pay Australian trade unions, the Musicians Union Australia and the Media, Entertainment & Arts Alliance, one [trade union] for the musicians and one for the sound technicians. They make it so hard; it’s the most difficult thing I can think of. The boys [BURGERKILL boys] all had swab tests for bombs. This was at Perth Airport; they got hung up on by Immigration. They were held up for two to three hours in the airport and questioned by Customs and all that shit.

Jason: We call the company XENOPHOBIC as that is how people look at us. We knew their capabilities [BURGERKILL]. One of Australia’s more prominent metal music promoters said they are shit. No-one wanted to do anything with us. We registered our company as a small business here.

SOUNDWAVE is the biggest [festival]. That is the biggest thing ever to happen in Indo, playing with UNEARTH, LACUNA COIL, DEVILDRIVER in 2009, we were openers.

KJ: So how many shows did BURGERKILL play in Australia?

Jason: They played six shows, all in Perth. SOUNDWAVE [had] 20,000 [people], we opened at 12 noon. When we [BURGERKILL] played everyone could not believe their eyes [because] of the quality of the sounds. BURGERKILL played the most original of sounds. There is a history to it [now] for us. People are jealous of what we [XENOPHOBIC] are doing. SOUNDWAVE is the biggest thing in Australia. People approached us that those that use to refuse us.

[KJ: It was Gene Simmons of KISS who said: “Revenge is having them all work for you”!]

Jason: They copied us to try to bring another kind of band here. It is ironic, know what I mean? After this tour we did ALLEGIANCE TO METAL. In October 2009 we were opening in Jakarta for ARCH ENEMY and PSYCROPTIC...

KJ: Can we go back a bit, what bands toured through other companies which you thought were poor quality bands?

Jason: HUMONIC from Australia [toured Indonesia]; they don’t [even] have an album out. It really pisses me off. I don’t mind as long as they are good talents. I saw them live but it does not compare [favourably] to any high-school band in Indonesia, simple as that.

KJ: Where did ALLEGIANCE TO METAL go in Indonesia?

Jason: We went to Solo, Bandung, Malang [and] Bali. PSYCROPTIC was headlining the show.

KJ: Why do you think death-metal is so huge in Indonesia right now?

Jason: Death-metal is quite big in Indo. Death-metal is like a fashion, like a religion, mostly brutal death-metal and black-metal. It is much easier to sing in death-metal. It is popular as people can relate to it very easily, it s not glamorous like the glam music.

KJ: I notice that the Indonesian death-metal bands are not so strongly anti-religion like the western bands such as DEICIDE, VITAL REMAINS, IMMOLATION, INCANTATION, etc.

Jason: In Indonesia religion has never been the main part of the problem. You have to look at the whole nation. In most of Indonesia it is very multi-cultural. [For example] Javanese live in Sumatra. People tend to avoid writing about race and religion. How can you say something about Christianity when you live with the same people?

KJ: To me the Indonesian death-metal bands have more hardcore style lyrics like HATEBREED, AGNOSTIC FRONT or one of my favourite bands BIOHAZARD...

Jason: [Yes], it’s all about standing up for your rights, about corruption, like telling a fable of your own life. The singer of BURGERKILL, Ivan Scumbag, passed away in 2006. Singlehandedly he revolutionized the Indonesian metal sound. He had this aura, one of the best you can think of, like Glenn Danzig; you can pick up the unique singing style. There is a book in Indonesian language on BURGERKILL [by Kimung Core, ex-bassist BURGERKILL]. The singer – an Indonesian legend in metal you know? The guitarist is endorsed by Sector Guitars.

KJ: So which is now the biggest death-metal scene in Indo?

Jason: Bandung is the biggest metal scene, every time I go back to Indo I go there.

KJ: Is it very strong in the clubs and pubs there?

Jason: It is not so much about clubs, small nightclubs. BURGERKILL was banned from playing in Bandung for four years. The place capacity was 4,000 but there were 8,000 people inside, eleven people died, squashed up [KJ: other sources claim seven died].

KJ: Who was the headliner act for this show?

Jason: The band BESIDE, album Against Ourselves (2007), [they are] metalcore band.

KJ: So what happened after or as a result of the deaths at the BESIDE show?

Jason: Eleven people died. The police tried to blame the band. Our guitar player for BURGERKILL won’t take shit liked that. There was around eleven police for the whole crowd. A few of the boys were thrown into jail for a few days. It was a slap in the face for the police. They were beaten up. It was on CNN for Indonesia. The band was blacklisted for two years as was BURGERKILL. They were banned for over two years.

KJ: So how was it possible for you to stage ALLEGIANCE TO METAL in Bandung then after these problems?

Jason: We played ALLEGIANCE TO METAL quietly, we did not announce it. In March 2010 we played in front of 20,000 people in Bandung. BURGERKILL played. [There was] heavy security. They returned to Australia again – January 2010 – for INVASION OF NOISE II. They [BURGERKILL] were headlining it. They had a great name. We ended up playing BIG DAY OUT with FEAR FACTORY only in WA [Western Australia].

KJ: How do you feel know about what you have achieved in organizing these tours based on your original vision?

Jason: I want to showcase the Indo talent. I pay from my wages working in the tattoo shop [KJ: Jason has since stopped working at the tattoo shop]. It’s pretty brutal, I will do it again if I can, it’s an achievement, I’m proud of it, [and] it made history. If I don’t do it no-one else will do it. People are very xenophobic. I believe we came out triumphantly. I would do it again over and over.

KJ: OK, now please tell us about the DEATH VOMIT tour to Australia. You know I was there at the Brisbane show in Step Inn, if you remember you personally sold me a copy of The Prophecy CD that night before it was sold out...

Jason: I wanted to find different kinds of music. Perth is very much into death-metal stuff. Roy [Agus, DEATH VOMIT] is one of the best drummers in the world. The tour was a roller-coaster. We opened in Perth [for] DYING FETUS and NAPALM DEATH. The boys are very humble, they are very Indonesian. The last two shows [Sydney and Brisbane] they really came out of themselves.

[KJ: See my review of DEATH VOMIT 15 September 2010 Brisbane concert in “Concert Reviews” section of this website.]

Jason: The best crowd was in Perth, 180-200 [people]. We played with DYING FETUS, we did alright. People saw how good they are. We had two shows in Perth. We look at it as a success. People brought their friends for [the] second show. We got an invitation from SONIC FORGE. They want us to bring DEATH VOMIT again. We worked with BURGERKILL, biggest name in Indo, so we have no problems getting Indo bands, they will jump first thing. The problem is the airfares, most they pay themselves. Merchandise is so good, it’s such good promotion to come to Australia, any [Indo] metal band would love to go overseas, checking the scene over here.

KJ: Is there a profit to be made from it?

Jason: At the end of the day we would not make money out of it. We won’t just bring any metal band.

KJ: Did you experience any racism personally?

Jason: We don’t experience much racism. We don’t stand up for that kind of shit.

KJ: Please tell us more about who you think are the best musicians in Indo death-metal today.

Jason: The highlight of this band [DEATH VOMIT] is Roy. He plays with a few different sorts of bands. He’s fucking gifted and talented to be honest with you. It’s the genes! He is just out there if you think about it. In my eyes Roy Agus as a drummer [is best]. For guitar that guy from BURGERKILL, Agung Hellfrog [is best]. The other guy from DEADSQUAD [Jakarta] he’s fucking good shredder too. The [best] singer is between the JASAD singer [Man] and the DEATH VOMIT singer [Sofyan Hadi].

KJ: What do you think of Man? Next month I will go to Bandung to interview JASAD...

Jason: One thing I don’t like about Man [JASAD] is cigarette. It is very sad in Indo that there is a very high smoking rate. The image of metal is tough kids and they smoke. We don’t like it all, we try to avoid it, know what I mean?

KJ: If an Aussie wants to do a “metal tour” of Indo where should she or he visit in addition to Bandung?

Jason: Best place to go for metal is Borneo, Malang, [and] Yogya. They organize metal, Jogja Corpse Grinder, it’s like a club or society, they support each other. Bands in Indo don’t have the [poor] facilities we have in Australia. The major media back them up in Indo, cig companies or Hard Rock [Cafe] sponsors them. It’s a pretty good achievement.

KJ: Tell me more about the role of religion in Indo death-metal and about the Islamic fundamentalist and Jihadist bands in Jakarta?

Jason: Religion does not play a role in Indo heavy-metal. There is a split in Indo metal. METALLICA came to visit in 1991, there is a band ROTOR, thrash-metal, they play [like] SODOM, VENOM. They supported METALLICA, first band to release album in the name of metal. The singer/ guitarist became a hardline Jihadist. Over there [Indo] the religion does not impact much on the music.

Lauren: In Indo the religion is more easygoing, it’s easy, people are free to do what they want in their religion, they are not forced to do anything.

Jason: If you wear a metal shirt here people look at you as weird. Metal in Australia is more outcast. It’s very big in Indo. We are revolutionizing it, in Indo you can wear a metal shirt, [and] you have something to sell.

We had the argument in Indo three or four years ago that Sweden bands are big due to government support. The most isolated place in the world has good metal bands. Now everything is at the tip of your fingers. They are using metal in a good way. This argument is out there among the public. Yayat Achdiat, best producer, founding member of JASAD and guitarist, he is helping to put Indo music at a good level. Another extreme-metal band is FORGOTTEN [Bandung] and also FUNERAL INCEPTION [Jakarta].

KJ: How is the black-metal scene in Indonesia? I don’t hear you mention any black-metal bands in our conversation...

Jason: Black-metal bands are not that big in Indo. FUNERAL INCEPTION is standing out from the rest. The lyrics are taken out of the Koran. The “heaven is under the dog’s feet”, in Koran it says it is “under the mother’s feet”. He is anti-religion, every religion. There are Muslim youth who don’t like his ideas. Last year there was a big problem. Splinter groups in metal do one finger meaning only One God. They don’t use the devil’s horns. People became quiet, scared to answer it except FUNERAL INCEPTION [guys] argue very strongly.

KJ: How many bands were involved in this skirmish or disagreement?

Jason: There are only a handful of bands involved [in the skirmish] - FUNERAL INCEPTION leader Doni Iblis and, on the Muslim side, TENGKORAK, meaning “skull”.

KJ: What does this Muslim band sing about?

Jason: The band preaches about going to the mosque and praying. They are connected to Islamic [Defenders] Front [Front Pembela Islam, FPI]. These people want the country to become a Muslim country; they have their own publication, magazine.

KJ: What percentage of the scene do you think is fundamentalist and where is it strongest?

Jason: About 20% of hardcore metal people [are fundamentalist] mostly in Jakarta, Malang and Medan. We had an agreement to ignore them and not give them publicity. We have not heard from them much but they are around in the Indo metal community.

KJ: Does metal prevent terrorism in your opinion?

Jason: Often people ask [this] in Indo, metal gets people out of doing anything stupid, you know what I mean? It opens your head; you really see what is different. SIKSA KUBUR just released their album a little while ago, it’s a pretty good album, death-metal, some of them are Christian and some are Muslim.

KJ: I think that is about all mate. Thanks for everything you shared. Can we get a picture and, after that, can you give me a ride to the St Alban’s train station? Thank you. 

THE END***********